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Which is your favourite Ninja Turtle?
Leonardo 20%  20%  [ 1 ]
Donatello 20%  20%  [ 1 ]
Raphael 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Michaelangelo 60%  60%  [ 3 ]
Total votes: 5
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PostPosted: June 13th, 2008, 6:54 am 
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This poll, for some reason, is a matter of enormous curiosity to me. Who is the most popular Turtle? I've been thinking about posting it for ages - I don't know why I only got around to it now. I mean, we all have a favourite Ninja Turtle, right? :D Mine is definitely Michaelangelo, and I don't mind admitting to that now, but for some reason when I was a child I always used to tell my brother it was Donatello. It wasn't! The only reason for this that I can think of is me worshipping my brother, and not wanting him to think me immature in my choice of favourite Turtle. His favourite was Leonardo. Nowadays, I have the conviction to turn round and say, "But why? Leonardo is in no way interesting!"

The show was repeated on weekday mornings around post-EGB time, so I would have been about thirteen. We used to watch those episodes before school, and I developed a bit of a thing about Raphael, because he was moody and disillusioned like I was in those days. But I'm over that now (the moodiness and the thing about Raphael). My favourite Turtle has always been, and always will be, Michaelangelo.

Just before Christmas I went into a charity shop, and found a VHS with two episodes going for 50p. Definiely worth 50p.; I bought it. It was a good bit of nostalgia, but I find this particular show hasn't worn that well into my adulthood. I liked it, but I used to love it. It was all the rage when I was six, and I can be that precise because I can remember whose class I was in at school when all the hype was going on. And when two boys came up to me in the playground and started laughing at me because apparently I didn't know the Turtles' names. News to me!

In the UK, it was Teenage Mutant Hero Turtles, because Ninja was too violent. Changing the title and dubbing the theme tune (so we couldn't hear "He's a radical rat!" properly) seems kind of pointless, because the Turtles (and of course Splinter) constantly referred to themselves as Ninjas in the show, so if we watched it we were going to know that was what they were - and they weren't any less violent for changing the name anyway. But it is nice that they cared. Without wanting to get all Marge Simpson about it, our kids watching violent cartoons doesn't seem to be something that worries us these days.

What did used to bug me was that they sometimes coloured the headbands wrong, but I guess with four identical character designs it's easy to do. Still, that it had to happen in the only two title cards is annoying. Michaelangelo looking intense with a couple of swords, and Leonardo drooling over pizza? I think not!

I've only seen half an episode of the newer series. I was flicking through the channels whilst having my breakfast one morning, found the episode, started watching it and then had to dash off at the end of the first half. It was annoying, because the show was actually way better than I was expecting and I'd have liked to follow it through to its conclusion. Knowing what cartoons tend to be like nowadays, I was expecting a load of stupid Ninja action sequences (and maybe even a few fart jokes!), but what I saw was Donatello coming across an artist with a magic crystal on his pencil which brought his drawings to life, and having an intelligent discussion with him about it. That wouldn't have been out of place in an old episode. I guess I'll try again to watch some of those new ones.

April O'Neal was in that episode, but she obviously didn't make much of an impression on me because I've completely forgotten her. I never liked her much in the old shows either. One of the things I liked about EGB was that it no longer taught us that boys can grow up to be action heroes and girls can grow up to be secretaries. TMNT, of course, implies that boys can get turned into cool mutants (generally speaking - I know the Turtles started life as turtles, not humans) and girls can grow up to be the plucky young woman who helps them out. One of the episodes I got on that VHS was April turning into a mutant cat for a brief period. It reminded me of "Janine Melnitz: Ghostbuster" (which I saw on cable within living memory). The guys get to be the cool action heroes in every episode, and the woman gets to take time out from her usual role and do something cool in just one (or maybe a few more in Janine's case - please don't shoot me down for not remembering!). Ah well, never mind. That was the times.

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PostPosted: June 13th, 2008, 10:00 am 
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I don't think I ever admitted this on the boards, but in the Old Days (I'm talking almost twenty years ago) we sometimes had the Ninja Turtles show up in our GBI games. Hey, both had irreverent undertones, were set in New York, and wildly popular at about the same time. We did several crossovers that, looking back, were one part inspiration and nine parts Epic Fail, such as "Shredder and Krang kidnap Egon to repair the Technodrome's dimensional warp drive" and Venkman trying to romance April O'Niel (Casey Jones being essentially a nonentity in the old cartoon)

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What did used to bug me was that they sometimes coloured the headbands wrong, but I guess with four identical character designs it's easy to do. Still, that it had to happen in the only two title cards is annoying. Michaelangelo looking intense with a couple of swords, and Leonardo drooling over pizza? I think not!


Lol...you want confusion? In the original Mirage comics they all wear red headbands. The first time I ever picked up one of their comics the cover confused me--"Why does Raphael have katana on the cover?" I was so glad the comics were in black and white so I could pretend that everyone was wearing their "real" colors. To this day it's another parallel to Ghostbusters to me: having all the guys dressed in "Ray's" flight suit is as boring as all four Ninja Turtles wearing "Raphael's" mask.

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I've only seen half an episode of the newer series. I was flicking through the channels whilst having my breakfast one morning, found the episode, started watching it and then had to dash off at the end of the first half. It was annoying, because the show was actually way better than I was expecting and I'd have liked to follow it through to its conclusion. Knowing what cartoons tend to be like nowadays, I was expecting a load of stupid Ninja action sequences (and maybe even a few fart jokes!), but what I saw was Donatello coming across an artist with a magic crystal on his pencil which brought his drawings to life, and having an intelligent discussion with him about it. That wouldn't have been out of place in an old episode. I guess I'll try again to watch some of those new ones.


That was a good one. It was actually adapted from one of the original Mirage comics, and was done as a tribute to legendary comic artist Jack Kirby, who co-created about half the characters in the Marvel Universe as well as a few for DC (ie Darkseid and the New Gods). Then Peter Laird ruined the story some a few years ago by basing probably the second or third most retarded plot twist of all time on it, but I won't go into that unless you want me to.

I quite like the new show, and as much as I loved the old voice actors, I think most of the new ones are just as good if not better; as much as I like Rob Paulsen's work, I think the newer Raph is better. Mikey is a spot on duplicate of Townsend Coleman's version, with this hilarious little shreik of fear that makes me laugh every time I hear it. About the only real exception is Leo--I just don't think I like the newer guy as much as I liked Cam Clarke. And it's funny that the new show provides a direct link between the two Japanese monster tamer shows: April O'Niel is Veronica Taylor, who used to do Ash Ketcham on Pokemon; Donatello is Sam Regal, who is also Kudamon on Digimon Data Squad. Just a fun little factoid.

It's all fresh on my mind because, though I kind of tuned out during the 'Fast Forward" arc (Not really because it was sorta mediocre, but because it was on at the same time as Legion of Super Heroes), they just finished running the "lost episodes" that they had done, but skipped to rush "Fast Forward" onto the air. It was an awesome arc that basically retconned Shredder into a badass demon lord without undoing the character's entire previous history.

Er...anyway, I guess when it comes down to favorites, it's another Ghostbusters parallel: I love them all, think they're at their best when playing off of each other, but at the end of a the day if I have to pick one it'd be the brains of the outfit, Donatello.

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PostPosted: June 13th, 2008, 1:20 pm 
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My favorite turtle was always Michaelangelo. Hell, like every parents' and censor's nightmare come true, the turtles inspired my interest in the martial arts.

I found out I was very good at it. 8-)


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PostPosted: June 13th, 2008, 2:23 pm 
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fore me its Leonardo then Raphael then Donatello and Michaelangelo

but then I like the all foe different reason's




EGBFan wrote:

I've only seen half an episode of the newer series. I was flicking through the channels whilst having my breakfast one morning, found the episode, started watching it and then had to dash off at the end of the first half. It was annoying, because the show was actually way better than I was expecting and I'd have liked to follow it through to its conclusion. Knowing what cartoons tend to be like nowadays, I was expecting a load of stupid Ninja action sequences (and maybe even a few fart jokes!), but what I saw was Donatello coming across an artist with a magic crystal on his pencil which brought his drawings to life, and having an intelligent discussion with him about it. That wouldn't have been out of place in an old episode. I guess I'll try again to watch some of those new ones.



I would definitely say do it




EGBFan wrote:

April O'Neal was in that episode, but she obviously didn't make much of an impression on me because I've completely forgotten her. I never liked her much in the old shows either. One of the things I liked about EGB was that it no longer taught us that boys can grow up to be action heroes and girls can grow up to be secretaries. TMNT, of course, implies that boys can get turned into cool mutants (generally speaking - I know the Turtles started life as turtles, not humans) and girls can grow up to be the plucky young woman who helps them out. One of the episodes I got on that VHS was April turning into a mutant cat for a brief period. It reminded me of "Janine Melnitz: Ghostbuster" (which I saw on cable within living memory). The guys get to be the cool action heroes in every episode, and the woman gets to take time out from her usual role and do something cool in just one (or maybe a few more in Janine's case - please don't shoot me down for not remembering!). Ah well, never mind. That was the times.


well her is also a were she get mutated into part fish and I think one were she becomes part bug . there was also a episode were Raphael meets a mutant salamander girl and she helps out the turtles .



Fritz wrote:

I quite like the new show, and as much as I loved the old voice actors, I think most of the new ones are just as good if not better; as much as I like Rob Paulsen's work, I think the newer Raph is better.



yes i would say that as well




DrVincentBelmont wrote:
the turtles inspired my interest in the martial arts.



same here her I can remember that first dat were every one was acting like the

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PostPosted: June 23rd, 2008, 1:48 pm 
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EGBFan wrote:
April O'Neal was in that episode, but she obviously didn't make much of an impression on me because I've completely forgotten her. I never liked her much in the old shows either. One of the things I liked about EGB was that it no longer taught us that boys can grow up to be action heroes and girls can grow up to be secretaries. TMNT, of course, implies that boys can get turned into cool mutants (generally speaking - I know the Turtles started life as turtles, not humans) and girls can grow up to be the plucky young woman who helps them out. One of the episodes I got on that VHS was April turning into a mutant cat for a brief period. It reminded me of "Janine Melnitz: Ghostbuster" (which I saw on cable within living memory). The guys get to be the cool action heroes in every episode, and the woman gets to take time out from her usual role and do something cool in just one (or maybe a few more in Janine's case - please don't shoot me down for not remembering!). Ah well, never mind. That was the times.


April was a reporter and a well known one at that, and most especially in the movies you see that she was the kind of gal who wasn't afraid to go after the big story, even if it meant getting herself in over her head. That's how she met the turtles in the first place. So she wasn't a fighting machine, But she was still a valuable member of the team because she was the only one who could function in the normal world. April was important because she was a constant in an extraordinary situation and emotional support for a group of teenagers who didn't know how to feel about the world.

April's taken a bunch of different roles according to different takes on the turtles. In the old comic she was Baxter Stockmen's lab assistant when he made the mousers. In the cartoon and movies she was a reporter, and in the later comics by image she had her hands all over in the place, even as an owner of an apartment complex in which all the turtles lived.

If that's not good enough then, well, I dunno what to say, everything's F-ed up like that. EGB is guilty of gender bias as well. Kylie doesn't use a regular proton pack, why? Because she's just so small? She's also the first one to get nabbed by ghoulies or the first to get hurt by one. And she's much more valuable as brains rather than brawn, and Janine in the end, is also just a secretary.


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PostPosted: June 23rd, 2008, 4:17 pm 
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I never said April wasn't an important part of the team, or not good enough. I watched the show, and I know what she did. I said she wasn't a mutant. I would hope that if the show had been created in recent years (like if it didn't exist in the eighties and nineties), at least one Ninja Turtle - but hopefully two - would be female.

Jason has mentioned a few female mutants in the show, which I would say are the exceptions that prove the rule. The regular mutant characters were the four Turtles, Splinter, and Beebop and Rocksteady. That's seven male mutants. I remember a couple of episodes with four frog mutants, and a crocodilian of some kind - either a crocodile or an alligator, I don't remember which. They were all male. Baxter also got turned into a fly at one point, and made more than one appearance thereafter. My memory of the show isn't perfect, but from what I do remember (which I stress, again, isn't everything), I count thirteen male mutants, and April getting to be a cat for one episode.

If you take a look around this board maybe, but first and foremost the old one, you'll see that Kylie's proton pistol has been discussed - and generally disliked by everyone - and that I am the first to complain about the number of times Kylie has to be rescued in proportion to the number of times she gets to do the rescuing. In fact, I happen to know I did that in the "Eduardo and Kylie" (or possibly "Kylie and Eduardo" - I can't remember) thread on the archived board. Whilst the show is not totally 50/50 between the genders, I've said any number of times how gratifying it was to see a female Ghostbuster at all. It was better than seeing four guys with their lady secretary in RGB, and no longer implied that boys can grow up to be action heroes and girls can grow up to be secretaries.

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PostPosted: June 23rd, 2008, 5:37 pm 
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EGBFan wrote:
I never said April wasn't an important part of the team, or not good enough. I watched the show, and I know what she did. I said she wasn't a mutant. I would hope that if the show had been created in recent years (like if it didn't exist in the eighties and nineties), at least one Ninja Turtle - but hopefully two - would be female.


If it was created brand new right now, yeah, probably. But they couldn't create a female turtle and retcon her in, because....they tried that already.

Back in 1998 or so, Saban did a live action version of the Tutles called Ninja Turtles: The Next Mutation, which was a colossal failure and pretty much remembered for only two things: A really really stupid crossover with Power Rangers In Space, and the introduction of Venus, the female Ninja Turtle. To their credit, as I recall she didn't look like a swimsuit model with a turtle head (she wasn't really all that different from the boys) and avoided the colossal cliche of a pink bandanna--it was blue, but a much lighter shade than Leo's

The fan reaction was scathing. Grife, Image Comics, which was publishing some bizarre TMNT comics at the time (featuring developments like Donatello becoming a cyborg), put a great big banner in one of their ads: "100% Guarantee: No Girl Turtle"

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PostPosted: June 23rd, 2008, 7:14 pm 
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Fritz wrote:
EGBFan wrote:
I never said April wasn't an important part of the team, or not good enough. I watched the show, and I know what she did. I said she wasn't a mutant. I would hope that if the show had been created in recent years (like if it didn't exist in the eighties and nineties), at least one Ninja Turtle - but hopefully two - would be female.


If it was created brand new right now, yeah, probably. But they couldn't create a female turtle and retcon her in, because....they tried that already.

Back in 1998 or so, Saban did a live action version of the Tutles called Ninja Turtles: The Next Mutation, which was a colossal failure and pretty much remembered for only two things: A really really stupid crossover with Power Rangers In Space, and the introduction of Venus, the female Ninja Turtle. To their credit, as I recall she didn't look like a swimsuit model with a turtle head (she wasn't really all that different from the boys) and avoided the colossal cliche of a pink bandanna--it was blue, but a much lighter shade than Leo's

The fan reaction was scathing. Grife, Image Comics, which was publishing some bizarre TMNT comics at the time (featuring developments like Donatello becoming a cyborg), put a great big banner in one of their ads: "100% Guarantee: No Girl Turtle"


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The concept art has her as being thin but I'm assuming they couldn't make her rubber suit that form fitting, as around that same time on the Real Adventures of Jonny Quest, Jessie Bannon's CG form was limited on screen because she was deemed "too sexy for kid's tv". Venus' character was also pretty lame; not nearly as good at combat as the boys and she generally opted for Chinese magic tricks. Her name was also given to her by the boys as her Chinese name was too much for them to bother with. (Her story is that she was in the bowl with the other turtles, crawled around in the mutagen as well, but was then washed down a drain to Chinatown where some dude found her and raised her as his daughter.)

The only interesting aspect of it all was that the boys only saw themselves as brothers due to circumstance rather than genetics, as they were just random turtles all in the same bowl at a pet shop, which later lead to them all trying to court her at some point. :hurl:

What would be interesting to me is a show with a strong female supporting or lead character who doesn't fall victim to being someone's love interest, mutant, human, or otherwise. Because let's be honest, strong women are either deemed unattractive because of their strength or unapproachable, because she obviously doesn't need a man to take care of her.


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PostPosted: June 24th, 2008, 12:42 am 
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Fritz wrote:

Back in 1998 or so, Saban did a live action version of the Tutles called Ninja Turtles: The Next Mutation, which was a colossal failure and pretty much remembered for only two things: A really really stupid crossover with Power Rangers In Space, and the introduction of Venus, the female Ninja Turtle.


to this day I still fined that funny

so just for shits and giggles


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bk_xUiwDxis





DonkeyPunch wrote:



The concept art has her as being thin but I'm assuming they couldn't make her rubber suit that form fitting, as around that same time on the Real Adventures of Jonny Quest, Jessie Bannon's CG form was limited on screen because she was deemed "too sexy for kid's tv". Venus' character was also pretty lame; not nearly as good at combat as the boys and she generally opted for Chinese magic tricks. Her name was also given to

her by the boys as her Chinese name was too much for them to bother with. (Her story is that she was in the bowl with the other turtles, crawled around in the mutagen as well, but was then washed down a drain to Chinatown where some dude found her and raised her as his daughter.).


that is vary similar to Mondo gecko origin .


it's odd but the thought of a girl turtle doesn't really dither me that much . provided they do it in a was different then what was on that god offal tv show .


1 ) she could have bin a human that was mutated in to a turtle.

2) she could have started out as a bad guy . Heck after seeing how much trouble Slash ( the evil turtle ) gave the guys . shredder could have made her and trained here to fight the guys .


3) . she could have bin some one that came back to earth after the the guys visited that planet of turtle people .


all are good i think but then if it where up to me she would team up with Metal Head ( the robot turtle ) and some of the other mutants


DonkeyPunch wrote:

What would be interesting to me is a show with a strong female supporting or lead character who doesn't fall victim to being someone's love interest, mutant, human, or otherwise. Because let's be honest, strong women are either deemed unattractive because of their strength or unapproachable, because she obviously doesn't need a man to take care of her.


well a lot of time they make it where they have a big chip on there shoulder for no real good reason .

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PostPosted: June 24th, 2008, 7:22 am 
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Fritz wrote:
If it was created brand new right now, yeah, probably. But they couldn't create a female turtle and retcon her in, because....they tried that already.


Yes, indeed, I was very careful to specify that they'd be a new creation. I knew the introduction of a new female Turtle, after everything, wouldn't work - but I didn't know they'd tried it already.

I guess they named her after the Venus de Milo because there were no female Renaissance artists; only art subjects (because women were things of beauty, not action, in those days). I bet I could write a really good essay about the implications of that, but as my university professors aren't here, I'll assume there was no malice intended.

I suppose her being part human is a reasonable excuse for her having something in the way of breasts. I guess she'd be more likely to have them than the toads in the world of Bucky O'Hare and the Toad Wars (and they do).

Sooty - a little yellow bear puppet who was on TV for over fifty years - I'm guessing isn't well known in the US. That's such a shame, because there's a very long, pretty funny story about what went on with his female sidekick (a panda called Soo). But I doubt if anyone's interested. :(

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PostPosted: June 25th, 2008, 2:03 pm 
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The Venus de Milo is actually the Aphrodite of Milos and it's from Classical Greece not the Renaissance. My question is, outta all the work produced in those two periods, why would they choose the one with no arms? Like, what's the underlaying meaning in that?


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PostPosted: June 25th, 2008, 10:56 pm 
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There probably is no meaning, they just picked the first famous female name from art that popped into their heads.

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PostPosted: June 26th, 2008, 4:38 pm 
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This whole Female turtle thing reminds me of the ghostbusters (Marty) issue. If there is ever a rule to anyone coming into a story that has a fanbase like both GB and TMNT, that is don't add characters in to make it fresh. especially in GB case because its also timelined back to 1991. which is GB's video games second mistake, don't do past setting events with new content.

Back to TMNT chick.....

Along with the name issue which I could have looked away on, this missing turtle story add on and then the fact she was raised to be a fighter anyways..........Yeah thats really funny how that happened. Too unlikely!
How can a fan really take that seriously? How can anyone take that seriously?! Sorry, but she proved by being there, that the show was nothing more than a way to make a few more action figures and sell more color bands.

As for the color of her band being Cyan, um, leo is too close to that color. I hate to say it, either pink or yellow, which then makes the whole morphin power ranger issue come up. My My, this is a hopeless idea they had. lol

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PostPosted: June 26th, 2008, 6:01 pm 
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devilmanozzy wrote:
This whole Female turtle thing reminds me of the ghostbusters (Marty) issue. If there is ever a rule to anyone coming into a story that has a fanbase like both GB and TMNT, that is don't add characters in to make it fresh. especially in GB case because its also timelined back to 1991. which is GB's video games second mistake, don't do past setting events with new content.


Sorry to continue the digression but...wow, you really are going to fit in here. This is kind of the only place in the GB Community that you see any skepticism about the game.

Er, anyway, let's not continue that track any further. There's an entire Video Game forum with plenty of places to complain about or defend it.

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Along with the name issue which I could have looked away on, this missing turtle story add on and then the fact she was raised to be a fighter anyways..........Yeah thats really funny how that happened. Too unlikely!
How can a fan really take that seriously? How can anyone take that seriously?! Sorry, but she proved by being there, that the show was nothing more than a way to make a few more action figures and sell more color bands.

As for the color of her band being Cyan, um, leo is too close to that color. I hate to say it, either pink or yellow, which then makes the whole morphin power ranger issue come up. My My, this is a hopeless idea they had. lol


I agree, yet at the same time I guess I have to give them points for NOT going with the stereotypical pink or yellow. White, maybe? And as previously mentioned, the irony in avoiding the Power Ranger issue, like you say, is that it was Saban doing the show (who did Power Rangers from 1993 through 2001) and the previously mentioned crapass crossover.

I guess the four turtles are just too established to shove in another one, male or female, though I think Venus provoked a backlash in part because it was seen as rather blatant PC pandering. On the other hand, I think a retconned in fifth male Turtle would have been poorly recieved too.

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