If there must be a vomiting smiley, my vote goes for the generic animated one.



Well if you absolutely insist on not reading the book first, bear in mind that the movie gets a lot of it wrong (and I hope your dad knows it too).

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'Extreme Ghostbusters was the best-written show, because it wasn't just about the ghostbusting, it was about the characters.' - Rino Romano

EGB Fan's EGB Fans
EGB Fan on FFN and AO3

I vote for the animated version.

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Tonight you will be visited by 3 ghostbusters.

I personally pefer the vomiting Slimer.

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I'll get you next time, Gadget! Next Time!- Dr. Claw, Inspector Gadget ending credits

We never would've lost if you koopaling clowns had tried to wake me up! Whose idea was this midnight attack?!- King Koopa, True Colors

I just discovered that flaming slash fics is a fine way for me to relax. Typically with a few bleeped-out F-bombs sprinkled liberally throughout.

I was recently a member of an RGB adult fan fiction group on Yahoo & I vented my irritation over slashing. I got into trouble over it, not surprising, they didn't like their precious slashing & beliefs being stripped down, so I just closed my account, there was mostly crap there anyway.

I said straight out that I think slashing is delusional & that if the writers of it really do believe in it, then they are just fooling themselves.

They really make mountains out of molehills & blow the smallest things way out of proportion!
You know: "Oh look Janine's wearing Peter's uniform in 'Janine Melnitz, Ghostbuster,' she must be in love with him." Nevermind the fact that he's the closest to her size than the others.
"Peter stopped Egon from drilling a hole in his head! He must love him!" Of course he would stop him 'cause that was a stupid thing to do!
"Winston & Ray shared a giggle in 'Troll Bridge,! They must be having a relationship!" Nevermind the fact that the troll was naked & looked awfully funny.
That's what really bugs me. They take the smallest moment & turn it into something it's not & they really believe it, saying that it could happen. Hence my believe that slashers are deluded.

I like reading a bit of the adult stuff, some of it's not too bad. A lot of it is absolute garbage!
Most of it I'll just skim through it enough to know what's going on. But I do find slashers seem to write the characters (for want of a better term) out of character just to suit their own selfish purposes.

It's funny because some slahers say they like & respect what JMS & the other RGB writers did. If they really liked & respected what JMS & Co did with the characters then they wouldn't write them they way they do. They'd follow in the footsteps of the RGB writers. I'd hate to think how JMS & the others would feel if they read any of it.

Even the J/E stuff is pretty awful! They do stuff where they're engaging in some out there stuff, and that's putting it mildly. Just completely wrong for them.
Worse is the gang bang stuff!

One thing slashers do that hurts Janine a lot is have her sleeping with each & every GB, either at various times or all at once! And in one story they had her carrying on with the temp fom "Janine's Day Off." It only perpetuates certain fans' beliefs that she's a slut!

The guys & the Janine I know & love would never act that way. Slashers just don't have a good grasp on the personalities of the characters & therefore just shouldn't write for them or at least shouldn't put it up on the net for all to see. It only invites flaming. Of course then they get upset about it & can't understand why they're being flamed.

Another thing I find that makes me shake my head in disbelief is that, even in non-slash, they turn the two shy guys, Egon & Ray into some kind of sex maniacs! I believe that the two of them blush at the mere mention of the word & would never act like that!

In slash they also have Janine jumping up & down like a valley girl when she finds out about Egon & Peter, shouting "I'm so happy for you two!" As if she'd act like that! More like she'd go off her rocker! And who'd blame her?

What's also funny is slashers also write non-slash. Huh? I ask. Then they say that they think it's perfectly fine & normal for them to do both & that they can have it both ways! I wonder just who they're trying to convince...

Some of it I'll read just so I can make fun of it in my own stories. Why not? It allows me to vent on my own terms.

In some Star Trek: Voyager slash fics they put Chakotay & Tom Paris together, even though they didn't even like each other that much, & Janeway watches! Yuck! What bugs me the most is that in Voyager Tom married B'Ellanna Torres & they had a daughter together! What do they not understand about that? Sigh!

I've come to the conclusion that there's no getting through to them 'cause they're too set in their crazy beliefs, so I think I'll just try to ignore it from now on. I got better things to do, like reading the good fics that I find here or writing my own.

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Cherish the past, embrace the future.

Next time, you could point out in the comics she had her own uniform, which looked more like Egon's



And yet they would probably accuse us of "making mountains out of molehills" when we point out things like "Ragnarok and Roll", "Robo Buster", and "Janine, You've Changed" You know, just like the Egon/Mary Sue writers. Or Venkman being heterosexually interested in a different woman an average of every other episode--that doesn't count either, at least to them.



The only canon they have backing up "She's a slut" is GB2, but if you include RGB and EGB, that's clearly an anomaly. But the slash writers "need" her to be a slut to justify Egon turning to Venkman for "comfort"



You know..."It's always the quiet ones" I even make a joke or two along those lines myself in "Zodiac Imperative". But yeah, that's way too easy to overdue and completely warp a character.



Yeah, that's so rational. Chase a guy for years, and be happy that he turned out to be gay and you never had a chance in the first place! That's so cool! Oh, and his Twu Wub is that guy you work with that you can barely stand? He's gay too, after all those women he chased over the years, and he even banged you one Thanksgiving? Yes! Awesome!!! You so wouldn't be ready to murder them both right then and there!!!



Sadly, I think you're right.

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LOL. I'll have to remember that one! I just hope they don't go, "Oh but that's only in the comics." They'd probably manage to find someway around it. But I'll give it a go.


Well I could always say "I'd hardly call the events of 'Janine, You've Changed' making a mountain out of a molehill. It was a mountain to begin with!"


Yeah, she wasn't in her right mind at the time! That's all.


It's fine to make jokes along the lines of "It's always the quiet ones." But some of them go too far. Also none of it is ever romantic or sweet. It's almost always a "Wham. Bam. Thank you M'amm" type of thing. It's just PWP. I don't care for that at all. If I'm gonna read a love scene I like to have emotion. I suppose these writers wouldn't know how to write believable emotions even if they had a gun to their head!


Actually I did see one where poor hapless slashfic Janine walked in on them & she went off her rocker. She screamed & ranted at Egon & then stormed out never to return! That at least was somewhat realistic.
But all Venkman did was stand there like an idiot & didn't say anything. All Egon did wass listen & then whisper "Goodbye, Janine." Which made it sound like good riddance in a way. I wish she had've pummelled Venkman until he was unconcious & slapped Egon so hard that it knocked him to the floor! That would've made her revenge complete as well as E/P slash haters like us.
Honestly though I would think that even if slash situations were to really happen that if Egon & Peter did care about her Janine as much as they claim that they'd let her know about it, instead of leading her on.


I think I'll just contend myself with laughing to myself about them because they are just so ridiculously sad.

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Cherish the past, embrace the future.

You should rent/borrow Trekkers. It's a documentary about Star Trek fans (Barbara Adams former Whitewater juror, emphasis on former, who arrived for jury duty in her STNG uniform).

They have a section devoted to Slash writers & readers (Fanzines); fans obsessed w/1 particular character, etc....sound familiar? Pay attention to Chpt 21.

There are some real weirdos/losers, etc...especially the cross dressing science fiction folk singer! Gabriel Koerner is sad.

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Tonight you will be visited by 3 ghostbusters.

I saw that a few years back. Wasn't there a woman who is obsessed with Brent Spiner in it?
She goes out on her pattio & she looks over toward where he lives, because she lives not far from him, & has her "Brent Break."
Creepy! Look out Brent you have a potential stalker in that one!

You know something else about RGB slash that gets me is that sometimes rather than the characters being simply gay, they're bisexual!

One of them had Ray & Egon carrying on & Ray suggested to Egon that maybe he's Bi because he also likes Janine. I cracked up laughing because it was so stupid, it was funny!
Another time I read something that went along the lines of Egon liked men but he liked women more. I said out loud (and I didn't care who heard me) "He doesn't like men at all!"

I worry about the slash versions of GB & Janine. They're probably all going to end up catching a bunch of STDs from each other! Then the poor EGBs will probably get them too when they get bored of each other & want a few younger GBs! Now I'm giving myself the creeps! Yecch!

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Cherish the past, embrace the future.

Ungh. You're giving me the creeps too. Especially as not long ago the subject of Jackalman99 came up on GBN. Jackalman 99 was an Iraqi woman who loved Saddam Hussein. She also slagged me for using rude language in a story, but also posted in support of Janine/Egon/Kylie three-way action. Either this woman was insane or an only semi-competant troll.

But yeah, as far as Star Trek slashfiction goes (I've heard them credited for inventing the "art") I guess Egon/Venkman stories aren't surprising, as they have a certain similarity to the Kirk/Spock stuff personalitywise.

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I came across that Jackalman99 on You Tube. She was weird. She insisted that Janine was born in 1971. Which would have made her about 13 when she stated working for the GBs!

She hated RGB & practically ignored it's existance. Everytime I pointed out to her something about RGB she'd be like "Oh I never watch that! I don't like it! EGB is superior." She just seemed to want to pretend like RGB never existed. That's like saying classic Star Trek doesn't exist just because you like ST:TNG better. I myself do like ST:TNG more than classic Trek but I'm certainly not going to say classic Trek was a dream and never happened.

She was also always saying that Kylie is pretty, but Janine is prettier & that it was nice to have someone pretty to look at.
I don't know there's something there that makes me think she likes Janine a bit too much if you catch my drift.

She also said she'd like to see Egon & Kylie get together. Probably so she could have a shot at Janine. I think she's a bit like those Mary Sue nuts!

One time she went on about Eddie & Peter. "I don't know what women see in them. They're so alike. All they ever think about is sex, sex, sex." They may like sex, but I'm sure they don't think about it 24/7. There's more to them than that.

Another time she claimed that Eddie made several passes at Janine during EGB. I thought to myself 'When was that exactly' & asked her that very question. all she did was answer with "Oh all I remember was that there was a pretty girl holding a file & Eddie makes a pass at her."

I knew she was referring to the scene in "Witchy Women" when Janine is tearing up a file while venting over Egon & that Eddie was talking about one of the witches (or perhaps Kylie) & that he was not making a pass at Janine. I knew he didn't like Janine like that because in "The Crawler" he can't understand what Gregor Samsa saw in her.

So I challenged Jackalman99 to tell me the exact moment in the exact scene in the exact episode she saw this supposed pass in & that I just might believe her.

Naturally she couldn't because it didn't bloody well exist! So she said something vague about it again.

Man was she ever strange! When Eddyyong's account got closed she dissapeared from You Tube, hopefully never to return again.

As for Star Trek. I think it started up Mary Sues as well. At least I did read that somewhere. I think there was an ep of classic Trek wherein there was a girl named Mary Sue or something like that. It was a while back that I read that so I can't remember all of it.

And slash so I heard started out as stories about the friendships & comraderie that existed between characters like Spock & Kirk share, not a romantic or sexual relationship. It's a pity the turn that slash has taken since the very early days of fanfics because I like stories about platonic relationships.

Sigh!

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Cherish the past, embrace the future.

Now you all know I really dislike RGB slash of any kind and I did read some Ray/Winston slash and that was really gross, too. I'm not bashing I'm just wondering why people write the guys in homosexual realtionships even though none of the guys and Janine are homosexuals.

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I'll get you next time, Gadget! Next Time!- Dr. Claw, Inspector Gadget ending credits



We never would've lost if you koopaling clowns had tried to wake me up! Whose idea was this midnight attack?!- King Koopa, True Colors

I find this discussion quite funny, actually. It's like a competition to see who can be the most disgusted and personally outraged about slash fanfiction!



The character who was spun off in Torchwood (Captain Jack Harness) is canonically openly bisexual. When you consider that a) Jack is bisexual, b) the Doctor and Jack have shared a kiss in an episode of Doctor Who, and c) it is heavily implied that Jack will screw anything that moves, then it's not such an absurd thought that some people would choose to write Doctor Who slash.

Funny you mention Harry Potter slash as being something awful, when arguably the most popular Harry Potter fanfic series, the shoebox project, is Sirius/Remus slash. It's probably received more popular acclaim than anything else anyone has written in the Harry Potter fandom! It's not canon, either! A good slash story, written against canon; how can that possibly be!?!






Y'know, that's exactly the kind of inflammatory bashing and random insults Egon fans used to throw at us! What happened to you guys?

Much as I'd love to wax lyrical about how there are some great slash stories out there, believe it or not (quite honestly, I don't know what sort of crappy slash fiction you guys are reading, and I don't really want to know, either), and that not all slash is explicit (a point I've made before, but which some people seem very eager to ignore; no doubt because it helps add to the belief that all slash is 'disgusting' and 'dirty'), but I think I'd best not say anything else at the risk of having my arse flamed off!

I think we need some more positive smilies in this discussion. There are far too many puking ones in this conversation for my taste.

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"Welcome to Britain. We have prevailing south-westerly winds and 52% of our days are overcast so as a nation we are infused with a subtle melancholy -- leading to eccentricity, binge drinking and casual violence." - Bill Bailey.

Lol...I think you have a point there. This has gotten a little "I hate this more than you do!!!" hasn't it?

Fulll Disclosure: I haven't seen very much of the new Doctor Who. And after reading some of the criticism of it on Godawful.net, I'm not sure I want to...



Well, yeah. I guess part of my revulsion comes from being an "old timer". Back in my day, the writers and producers squashed pretty much any hint that the Doctor behaved in an "improper" way with any of those women he travelled with. He also had to drag the TARDIS through ten miles of snow uphill both ways to fight the Cybermen.

Having all of the Doctor companions--male and female--with the hots for him is a new thing; showing any hots back is even newer--it just simply Didn't Happen until 1996. I could swear I remember reading once that one of the reasons Colin Baker took over before the end of Peter Davison's last season is that it was too easy to picture the Fifth Doctor and Peri "crossing that line" if they were alone together too long. It was also one reason the Sixth Doctor was written as such an obnoxious prick. Compare that to now, where the Doctor's spent three years being a lovesick idiot, and both women and men want in his pants.

I'm not objecting to Jack Harkness being a bisexual slut. They exist, and they're not twisting a pre-existing character to do it. The twisting of a pre-existing character is what I object to. I'm objecting to the idea the Doctor is a bisexual slut, the same way I object to turning Peter Venkman gay or having Egon bang Mary Sues. The way I'd object to some fan fic writer writing Jack Harkness as a devout Christian, 100% heterosexual, and saving himself for marriage. And I'm objecting to the stupid idea that the Doctor's secretly in love with the Master, the guy who's tried to destroy or take over the universe dozens of times, and tried to kill the Doctor more than once (and, arguably, succeeded as many as two times)



Maybe it is. I dunno. I was pretty much scared away from HP fanfic by the mere mention of the catchphrase "Draco Malfoy in Leather Pants".

Can there be good slash? Maybe. But what it boils down to to me is that, well, for the most part "breaking canon" is exactly the issue.

People who write it are entitled to write it. If somebody enjoys it, fine. You're also entitled to draw pictures of Hermione Granger and Ginny Weasley mud wrestling in the nude. I'm entitled to not like it and ignore it, the same way EgonsBabe is entitled to ignore my stories.



No pukes on this post.

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I'm not sure you'd want to, either. It's becoming somewhat of an intergalactic snog-fest. I know some people think David Tennant is attractive (unfortunately he resembles an ex of mine, so the only thing I feel when I look at his is mild irritation), but it is getting slightly ridiculous.



The whole Master-in-love thing is ridiculous, I agree. I haven't read any Dr. Who slash personally, so I'm only going on what you're describing, which I agree sounds stupid. However, as you've already mentioned, his character is already being twisted to be some sort of babe-magnet when it never has been before, and yet it's canon. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if there were a bisexual Doctor at some point in the future, just as it wouldn't surprise me if there was a female, or black Doctor. He takes on different forms, and he's an alien species who at one point didn't even have any sexual proclivities whatsoever, and yet now, in the 21st Century, he's got a bit of a sex drive going on. If that can change, what else can?



Y'know, I don't object at all to the idea that some people just don't like slash, and will never like slash. That's entirely up to them and their own individual tastes. What I object to is the fact that people are taking the worst of the genre and holding it up as typical of the genre. The level of disgust aimed at these types of stories seem to be a little disproportionate when you consider the fact that there are some which are perfectly acceptable works of fiction, and some which are positively adored by the fanfic community in general.

Mary-Sues are so universally reviled that even Mary-Sue authors don't want to acknowledge that they've committed the cardinal sin of writing them, but slash fiction is different. Yes, there are terrible slash stories, I won't deny it. But I won't also go on to say that they are all awful, disgusting, dirty, whatever. Nor would I say that those who either write or enjoy it are deluded idiots, or sad and worthy of pity.

Just to make it clear, I don't write any slash fiction, but I've read a few which aren't wild orgies, don't have Janine acting as a crazed harpy and which feature more than just random bareback humping. To have them all described as such is a fallacy which hadn't been corrected in this discussion thus far.

You are right to have your reservations about canon. They don't follow canon in the least, but then I think it would be quite boring if everyone stuck to canon pairings all the time. After all, Ray's canon pairing is Elaine Fuhrman, and your own stories deviate from that (I'm assuming this is the case, as I still don't know for sure who he's tied the knot with -- I've yet to catch up on some GB fanfic). I know it's not as significant a deviation as slash fiction, but it's a deviation all the same.

I'm not trying to argue that the gays are gay -- personally, I don't think they are, but it doesn't prevent me from understanding that sexuality in fiction can be interpreted in all sorts of ways by all sorts of people. Certainly there are some who would interpret a man's tendency to wear pink as a signature colour and reluctance to date an attractive woman who wears short skirts and tight tops as an indication that he is not exactly a typically straight, red-blooded male. The same could be said of a grown adult who takes cuddly toys to bed with him, or of two men who hold hands, or a man who allows another man to sit in his lap -- facets of behaviour which could be more attributed to gay men rather than straight ones.

I'll admit, I did once hold the opinion that all slash fiction was awful, but then I found a few that I quite surprisingly found myself enjoying. For me, it's not about who kisses who or whatever, it's more to do with the quality of the writing itself. If it's a good story, well-written, with good characterisation and great plots, then I'm all for it, slash or straight. Hell, if I cared more about who was paired up with whom then I wouldn't have read the stories you wrote which make even the slightest mention of Louis and Janine in a relationship or once-married to each other, because I loathe the thought of them being together. In the end, reading your stories made me feel more compassion for Louis than I would have, had I not read them. It may be difficult for some people to believe, but I feel that in some cases the story is worth more than just its character-pairing.

And thanks for not puking.
I'm actually emetophobic, which doesn't really help much with the thought that people are puking up all over the place at the thought of it all.

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"Welcome to Britain. We have prevailing south-westerly winds and 52% of our days are overcast so as a nation we are infused with a subtle melancholy -- leading to eccentricity, binge drinking and casual violence." - Bill Bailey.