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 Post subject: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: August 26th, 2007, 2:35 pm 
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Another thread revived/continued from the old board:
http://ectozone.proboards31.com/index.c ... 1113837144

Kylie Griffin and Eduardo Rivera were in Extreme Ghostbusters, and had a nice, eccentric dynamic that reminded me a lot of Venkman and Dana in the movies: slacker and sarcastic flirt starts chasing guarded woman who doesn't want to give him the time of day; Slacker surprises himself by developing genuine feelings for someone he originally saw as just another potential "score"; guarded woman surprises herself by developing feelings for the kind of guy she's tried to avoid thus far. You get the idea... (since Dana wasn't ever in the animation, this is probably as close as we got to seeing what they would've been like on the small screen)

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 Post subject: Re: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: August 27th, 2007, 6:54 am 
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I’ve had plenty to say about these two on the old board. Now, I’m going to begin all over again. You know how there are some things you just never get tired of?

Let’s start with the basics. This is your classic love/hate scenario. Kylie’s an independent woman who think she doesn’t need anyone, least of all the feckless slacker that Eduardo appears (key word there) to be. There are small things putting her off. He has a pretty bad attitude to many aspects of life, most notably work and education, and he gets on her nerves with his deliberate attempts to wind her up. But maybe those are just excuses. This young woman is someone who has suffered losses in her life, and doesn’t want to be forming a strong emotional attachment to a man who looks like one day leaving her. (Or maybe I’m reading too much into it.)

It seems to me that Kylie both loves and hates Eduardo equally, most of the time. I’m not sure the reverse is true. He professes not to be interested in having a romantic relationship with her, but this is after he’s given it a go at the end of “Darkness at Noon” - I think his denial might mostly be a pride thing. But anyway, with these kinds of relationships, it’s always fun to watch the characters bicker. Then, when they do get a moment of goodwill between them, it’s even more fun to egg them on and hope they can finally realise that they love each other, damnit!

Most of those moments, I will have mentioned before. One I don’t remember talking about is their special little underground adventure in “Eyes of a Dragon”. Just the two of them, running away from and then attempting to ward off skeleton monsters, because they’ve managed to fall down a hole at an earlier point in the episode. It’s a bit bizarre, and subtly played. If you didn’t know, you might not realise they were anything more than work colleagues, never mind friends. It’s pretty much all business, but what they’re doing is helping and supporting each other after they’ve spent much of the episode having an argument about a subject that doesn’t matter a bit - they both care more about being right than about the subject matter, which is to do with the mechanics of light. That, actually, is a pretty good scene for Eduardo. He seems to have a secure scientific knowledge of how light works. Not entirely in character, of course - but hey, maybe he has hidden potential that comes to the surface if it means he gets to try and outsmart Kylie.

Because I’m such a dirty-minded person (or perhaps because I’m a person - and a writer - who appreciates the importance of every single aspect of a relationship… or something), I do enjoy the sexual overtones you occasionally get to see between these two characters. Not undertones. Overtones - more than in any other cartoon I can think of right now. Two scenes spring to mind here: the racy dream with the red stilettos and clingy little leather number in “In Your Dreams”, and the whole “She’s legal” thing in “Darkness at Noon”. “A good looking guy like you was really hard to resist. Kiss me, Eduardo! I want you to!” Tara Charendoff plays those kinds of lines beautifully. She actually sounds like she wants him to do a lot more than just kiss her. She has another seduction scene in that lovely little gem “Till Death Do Us Start” - possibly my favourite episode overall, and certainly the best one for the Ed/Ky dynamic. This particular scene is just marvellous. It’s not Eduardo she’s seducing, and Rino Romano plays the jealousy perfectly.

There are sexual undertones as well, of course. In “Seeds of Destruction”, there’s a moment after Eduardo has had to barge Kylie out of the way of a falling overlarge brick, which results in him lying on top of her in a pretty suggestive manner - it’s just really fun. But shall I get into the whole rescue thing again? It’s not my favourite way of doing moments. They’re very obvious, extremely clichéd and action-driven, which can never be as good as a character-driven scene where romance is concerned. I’ve said before that it bugs me the way he gets to save her life - ooh, probably the thicker end of ten times; and she gets to do it once in return. But they’re all still crucial stages in their relationship, so I can’t grumble too much.

Right now I’m skimming through an episode guide, wondering how closely I can analyse the progress of their relationship. Well, I shall try. I really believe that the episodes, as a general rule, get increasingly deeper and more character-driven. “The Unseen” is episode 10. Up until this point, it’s mostly Eduardo wanting Kylie for her body, and her being pretty much uninterested. But then, once they’ve had to spend about twenty-four hours together tracking down their stolen proton guns and trying to deal with the demon Tenebrach, they’ve grown a little bit closer and Kylie says - as I have already quoted in another thread today - “Eduardo’s not so bad. Once you scratch the surface.”

After this, we get into “The Crawler” (11), “Be Careful What You Wish For” (13) and “Ghost Apocalyptic Future” (18). In these, Eduardo seems to have some pretty genuine feelings for Kylie (which you might miss in “The Crawler”; it’s an incredibly subtle little bit right at the end), but she still pretty much isn’t interested. She decided a while back that he’s “not so bad”, but still she doesn’t seem to want to be more than friends. Episode 20 is “Seeds of Destruction”, in which another rescue occurs after the one I’ve already mentioned. It finishes up with an overlong look between the two of them. I like to think she’s realising something there.

Episode 28 is “Eyes of a Dragon”, whose significance I’ve pretty much covered. Ditto “Till Death Do Us Start”, which comes next. By this time, Eduardo is quite clearly desperately in love, and I think Kylie’s getting there too. The little moments between them in “Back in the Saddle, Part 2” are quite nice (bad as the episode was). Then it’s all ruined by “Witchy Woman”, which should have been shown before BITS (now that’s a good acronym!) anyway, and which finishes with Eduardo accepting a phone number from another woman. Gah! I have made my own interpretation of that, and written it into my fanfiction (some of which has yet to be released): though it breaks his heart, Eduardo has given up on Kylie because he thinks she’s not interested, not realising that she is in fact burning with jealousy when he asks Bess out on a date. That, or something like it, should really have come across in the episode - but it just didn’t.

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 Post subject: Re: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: May 10th, 2011, 5:22 pm 
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Nobody has replied to this post for quite a while so I am going to continue! ;)

I really ship Kylie and Eduardo. They really work great together and you get the feeling that you almost can feel their attraction to one another while watching them on the screen. For me, they really push the dynamic interaction between the characters.
It's not that I don't fancy Egon and Janine, which I do indeed, but I just hang on Kylie and Eduardo.
I was about 10 to 12 when I first watched EGB and noticed that there was something special between them that was going beyond working in a team or being friends. Consequently they remind me a little bit of first love. The excitement you feel when love is new to you. Everything was so unknown. Maybe that's the reason I fancy those two so much.
In addition to that I really think that they are completing each other.On one hand, Kylie is a girl that does not expose her feelings openly, but Eduardo does. For Example, he is not scared of admitting fear as seen on several occasions like during 'Fear itself' or 'Darkness at noon'. Kylie seems to be very in control of herself and her emotions. She is not the kind of girl to jump up and go crazy. Although Eduardo cannot control his feelings as good as she can, one reason why I like him so much. It just lets him seem more human, allowing himself to have mistakes.
On the other hand, Kylie provides the intellectual input, Eduardo does not have or is not familiar with.

I really like their development during the season and I would have loved to see their relationship grow in other seasons. That does make me a little bit sad though.

I guess their development would have been faster than that of Janine and Egon as either Kylie nor Eduardo are blind when it comes to love.

I also love the sexual hints now and then which also allows them to appear more human. I think cartoon figures are often too oblivious to love and sexuality. I know that these are shows for children, but children often know more than they are expected to know and I often wonder whether it would be better to include sexuality in a very natural and decent way. I don't mean any scenes showing intercourse of something or talking about in an artificial way, but including hints now and then is fine.

I love Eduardo's hint in 'Fear itself'! Kylie asks the group why they think she was vampyra and Eduardo says that it was because she liked Nine Inch Nails! A band that has very explicit sexually related lyrics. I just love the scene. It reminds me of the Simpson's: Children laugh because they think its funny, adults laugh because they really understood the humour which is indeed a very dirty one at times *evilsmile*!

Anyway, Kylie and Eduardo are a couple I would love to have explored their further development a little bit more! They have been fascinating me and they still do.

X
Jen


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 Post subject: Re: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: May 10th, 2011, 5:30 pm 
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Very good comments.

I have to direct you to the work of EGB Fan, the second poster in this thread. She's really done a lot of good stories centered around these two characters. (She's also done good stuff with the Venkman family, but that's not really the point in this thread)

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=28

http://www.fanfiction.net/u/653385/EGB_Fan

http://thornyenglishrose.deviantart.com/

Check some of that out--I doubt you'll be disappointed.
:)

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 Post subject: Re: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: May 10th, 2011, 5:41 pm 
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Thanks! I'll definitly check it out! I have found her ideas in the 2nd post of this thread just amazing! ;) Yay, another fangirl!

Off topic: I really think it's very hard to find good fan sites on GB. I really had to turn the web up and down in order to find ectozone. It makes me a little bit sad. The show was so big, not even starting to speak about the movies, but the online fandom is small compared to other series/movies. (Off topic end)

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 Post subject: Re: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: May 10th, 2011, 5:46 pm 
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get_Josie4 wrote:
Off topic: I really think it's very hard to find good fan sites on GB. I really had to turn the web up and down in order to find ectozone. It makes me a little bit sad. The show was so big, not even starting to speak about the movies, but the online fandom is small compared to other series/movies. (Off topic end)

X
Jen


Well, it has it's good side--a small, relatively quiet fandom means it's short of the drama queens and squeeing fanbrats more popular stuff has.

It's one more reason I shudder at the thought of a third movie being made. A new movie with some young, pretty actors and we could go the direction of Doctor Who :x

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 Post subject: Re: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: May 10th, 2011, 7:27 pm 
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You're right about it! I've experienced a few communities so far and many were run over by 12-year olds (a group of people I
don't want to blame as a whole, but only some individuals) who were trying to absolutely make their points heard via disrespecting others and swearing as much as they probably could or just spamming or fighting with other 12-year olds.

Now that's really a good reason that the GB movies, RGB and EGB are comparatively old cartoons/ movies.

By the way, thank you for such a warm welcome.

Back to topic:

Do you happen to know any fanart platform that also has EGB fanart, especially Kylie and Eduardo and as well Egon and Janine?

X
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 Post subject: Re: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: September 1st, 2011, 7:37 am 
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Hi, get_Josie4. It certainly is nice to have a fellow Ed/Ky shipper on board. :)

EGB fanart is extraordinarily difficult to come by. Maybe if you and I gang up, we can nobble Fritz into doing some more. ;) In the meantime, I'd recommend a look at wolfenmoondaughter's Ghostbusters page on deviantART: http://wolfenmoondaughter.deviantart.co ... y/25609720

There aren't many pictures in there, which is too bad, but let that not take away from what she has posted. There are one or two little gems in there, and actually, I think a lot of people here would be interested in her anniversary ensemble picture. (It has Garrett's one-time love interest Persephonethius in it, whom I didn't like very much at all, but she's there in the show and Wolfie is a stickler for canon love interest, so I mustn't and don't object.)

As for my stories, I wrote a lot of them over quite a few years. Some are better than others, and some have some strange ideas in them that I'm not sure where I got them from. So, if you're going to try wading through them or picking out a select few, go carefully! :P

get_Josie4 wrote:
On one hand, Kylie is a girl that does not expose her feelings openly, but Eduardo does. For Example, he is not scared of admitting fear as seen on several occasions like during 'Fear itself' or 'Darkness at noon'. Kylie seems to be very in control of herself and her emotions. She is not the kind of girl to jump up and go crazy. Although Eduardo cannot control his feelings as good as she can, one reason why I like him so much. It just lets him seem more human, allowing himself to have mistakes.


Some interesting and very good points there. Eduardo is certainly happy to show fear when he's feeling it, often to comic effect, which sometimes works and sometimes makes him seem much less of a diverse and interesting character than he actually is. With any cartoon, character traits will grow and shrink and disappear and be totally misunderstood, depending on who wrote the episode.

It took me a few viewings of the whole series to notice that Eduardo, although he often shows emotion (fear, anger, humour, relief, sometimes joy, though he prefers to keep that one to himself) is very averse to revealing his true thoughts and feelings. He comes with subtext. Look at how he won't talk to anyone about his relationship with Carlos in 'Rage', but we're left to piece it all together for ourselves. My favourite scenes for Eduardo are the ones where he says nothing, or almost nothing, and definitely doesn't say what he thinks. I'm thinking specifically of the talkie-scene in 'Til Death Do Us Start', which I'm always going on about, and also 'Slimer's Sacrifice', when Roland is briefing him on going into the containment unit. All his emotions are conveyed through his face, including some that he's trying to hide. It's very cleverly done. And obviously, I've seen it far too often. :P

I've noticed that Kylie is sometimes happy to start talking about her feelings at odd - well - semi-relevant moments. Off the top of my head, I can think of two occasions when she brings dear departed Grandma Rose into the conversation without much prompting. I think that she, too, has stuff that she doesn't talk about, but I don't see any implication that there's a great deal more bubbling beneath the surface, unlike with Eduardo, who goes to great lengths not to talk about his family history, his hopes for the future and so on. One of the more subtle contrasts between them to be spotted, I think. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: January 15th, 2015, 6:51 pm 
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Five Ed/Ky moments for the eagle-eyed, in reverse order of subtlety (imo):

1. "Bird of Prey"
When the Ghostbusters are hiding behind a car from the Hraesvelg's gale-force winds, Kylie is clutching Eduardo's shoulder like a limpet. When she runs out to retrieve the Sceptre of Donar, Eduardo makes a grab to try and stop her. This serves as a nice prelude to the rather less subtle, "Are your hands okay?"

2. "The Pied Piper of Manhattan"
During the climax of this episode, Eduardo grabs Kylie just in time to stop her from being blown away by the Piper's magical wind.

3. "A Ghost in the Machine"
Eduardo looks somewhat delighted when Kylie elbows him in the ribs, rather hard, for saying something a little stupid.

4. "The Crawler"
In the final frame of this otherwise Ed/Ky-dry episode, following Egon's amusing line, "Well, I wouldn't want to rush into anything; you have to play these things cool", Eduardo directs a soppy look at the back of Kylie's head.

5. "Darkness at Noon, Part 1"
In the lecture hall, even at this stage when Kylie doesn't think she's going to like Eduardo very much, they exchange a look when Roland starts spouting praise for the Ecto-1 and other Ghostbuster hardware.

Collected after my latest watch-through, which finished today. The fact that I'd spotted all of these a long time ago may indicate that I've watched the series too much. :geek:

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 Post subject: Re: Kylie And Eduardo
PostPosted: August 2nd, 2016, 4:13 pm 
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I have always thought of the Eduardo and Kylie relationship as the true heart of Extreme Ghostbusters. I was impressed with the characterisation and interaction in the show, and this pairing was clearly always going to be the most interesting and enduring.

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